Exclusive Interview with Michael Saylor: $62 Billion is Just the Beginning, MicroStrategy's Bitcoin Reserves Will Increase Exponentially

Original author: Michael Saylor, Founder of Strategy

Compiled by｜Odaily Planet Daily (@OdailyChina)

Translator｜CryptoLeo（@LeoAndCrypto）

Recently, Michael Saylor was interviewed by a CNBC reporter, and they discussed the rise of corporate Bitcoin reserves, the future of crypto policy, and a clear framework for digital commodities, securities, currencies, and tokens to promote industry development.

Odaily compiled it in a Q&A format, the full content is as follows

Q1: Welcome Saylor’s attendance, this week there are many announcements focused on corporate Bitcoin reserves, such as Gamestop announcing a $500 million Bitcoin holding, and Trump’s media plan to establish a $2.5 billion Bitcoin treasury. What do you think about this new trend, are they doing the right thing?

Saylor: There is no force in the world that can stop an idea whose time has come. The most surprising thing in the past few months has been the surge of energy and enthusiasm surrounding corporate Bitcoin reserves. The announcement by Trump Media was unexpected; it was an extremely bold, proactive, and wise move. The announcement of the merger between Nakamoto Holdings and KindlyMD to build Bitcoin reserves was also surprising.

(Odaily Note: Nakamoto Holdings is a newly established company by Trump’s cryptocurrency advisor David Bailey - planning to collaborate with BTC Inc. to create the world’s first Bitcoin reserve company network.)

I remember telling David that if you believe in Bitcoin, you should raise a lot of money to buy Bitcoin. I provided an idea, and I was surprised that he actually did it, and I am very happy. I think the announcements from SoftBank, Tether, and Twenty One Capital are also great, as they will bring a large amount of SoftBank’s funds into the Bitcoin market, just as it is good to bring Masayoshi Son into crypto.

I think it’s great that Tether supports a publicly listed company in the United States. It’s important to note that Metaplanet was previously only a 10 million dollar company, and a few months ago it was only worth 1 billion dollars, but in the last week or two its market value has approached 4 billion or 5 billion dollars, making it one of the most successful stocks. In addition, the blockchain group in France has also risen rapidly, with astonishing growth.

At this conference, everywhere I go, people always mention to me: I started a bitcoin reserve company in Hong Kong, I’m working on this project in South Korea, I have a project in Abu Dhabi, we’re going to do this in the Middle East, we’re going to have this project in the UK, we’re going to launch one in Kenya, we’re going to launch one in Norway, we’re doing this in Germany. I think it’s fantastic, and it’s a good thing for Bitcoin. Now Brazil’s interest in Bitcoin is also exploding.

Each of these companies is bringing Bitcoin into another global capital market, and they’re solving compliance issues, capital market issues, registration issues, and political issues, and they’re all Bitcoin messengers, planting orange flags around the world. Stories always start with an adventurous move. And then it becomes: “Wow, this is a very successful adventure, I’ve never made that much money, tell me the story of Bitcoin, how can I make this money?” "Soon, a whole new generation of capitalists emerged who discovered that Bitcoin was digital capital, perhaps the most explosive idea of our time.

Q2: What do you think about Wall Street’s not-so-positive reaction to the announcements from Trump Media and Gamestop? After Gamestop announced the news, its stock price rose by 17%, while Trump Media’s stock price fell by 22%. This seems to contradict the reaction from Strategy investors?

Saylor: It is important to know that when Gamestop announced it was considering adopting a Bitcoin strategy, its stock price soared by 50%, and the trading volume increased tenfold. Subsequently, they entered the market with this momentum and successfully issued $1.5 billion in convertible bonds, raising $1.5 billion, perhaps because the market hoped they would purchase more Bitcoin.

So, I think the Trump media is because of the huge amount of funding, and a lot of it is convertible bonds. It is important to note that when you sell a convertible bond, 70% of the face value of the bond is shorted as a stock. Therefore, convertible arbitrageurs will always hedge against stocks and bonds, one long and one short. For example, in the short term, if a company announces a $1 billion secondary stock offering, the stock will fall, all of which are short-term dynamics in a long-term trend. **

It has been proven that Bitcoin on the balance sheet has become very popular, driving liquidity growth for similar companies. For instance, it has increased the liquidity of Gamestop and will also boost the liquidity and earnings of other companies. This may take three months, six months, and sometimes even up to a year. But this strategy is very reasonable, and all these companies will benefit from it.

Q3: You were the first to adopt Bitcoin reserves, and Strategy has a balance sheet with $62 billion worth of Bitcoin. Do you have a limit on the amount of Bitcoin you hold? Or do you have a fixed expected value?

Saylor: No, we will continue to buy Bitcoin, and we expect the price of Bitcoin to continue to rise, so it will be harder and harder to buy Bitcoin, but we will be exponentially more efficient in buying Bitcoin. You know, we used to think that raising $200 million was a challenge, and then we felt that raising $2 billion was a challenge. And in the fourth quarter, we’re going to raise $21 billion. So we’re going to get better and better, the price and value of Bitcoin is 10 times higher than when we started this journey, and the ecosystem is growing.

But I think the strategy is very simple, it is to issue a credit instrument such as preferred stock to provide dollar yield, or issue a portion of the upside yield of bitcoin while providing some downside protection. People will buy stocks, stock derivatives, or options because they want more leveraged Bitcoin; People will buy preferred shares because they want lower volatility, lower risk, and lower leverage with guaranteed returns. We’re going to take care of both, and as the ecosystem grows, there’s no reason why this model can’t continue to scale. **

Q4: The executive order to create a strategic Bitcoin reserve effectively tasked the Treasury and Commerce Departments with finding budget-neutral ways to purchase Bitcoin. Are you providing advice to the White House cabinet members, or do you have some suggestions regarding their approach?

Saylor: I believe we have a remarkable cabinet, with many Bitcoin supporters and a lot of great ideas. The Bitcoin Policy Institute has proposed many things, and several cabinet members have mentioned quite a few as well. Deciding what the U.S. government will do and when to do it is beyond my authority, but I do believe the U.S. is facing a terrific opportunity.

If I were to advise the United States, I would say that all the capital in the world will flow into cyberspace, into the Bitcoin network. It is in America’s best interest to own as much of it as possible before the rest of the world realizes this trend.

Q 5: I am very curious whether the fundamental idea of Bitcoin has changed. In the past, people believed that Bitcoin should not be linked to any government or central bank, but now we see the United States expressing this desire to become the cryptocurrency capital, hoping that all mining activities will be concentrated in the U.S. Does this undermine the original positioning of Bitcoin?

Saylor: If these governments want to hoard Bitcoin right now, I think it’s a very healthy competition. So, when the United States expressed its support for Bitcoin, Pakistan announced the creation of a strategic Bitcoin reserve, which inspired the UAE and the Middle East to start accumulating Bitcoin as well. Bitcoin’s adoption is accelerating in Brazil, as well as in Mexico, where businesses are getting moving. New York City Mayor Eric Adams took the stage to announce his intention to issue Bitcoin municipal bonds for New York City, which will incentivize Miami, Los Angeles, and San Francisco. You know, it’s healthy competition. There are enough resources for everyone to share, and the Bitcoin network is very vulnerable, and this balance of power is formed because the more participants who enter the ecosystem, the more diverse and decentralized the protocol becomes, and the more difficult it is to be corrupted and the more powerful it becomes. This means that it becomes more trustworthy to large economic agents who would otherwise be worried about staking their entire economic power on the Bitcoin. **

Q 6: The Meme coin TRUMP, associated with President Trump, has sparked much controversy. Many believe that it undermines the significant progress made on various cryptocurrency bills in Congress, which are now stalled. Senate Democrats have particularly mentioned TRUMP. What are your thoughts on this situation?

Saylor: I believe that for the crypto economy, the crypto industry, and the United States to build a $100 trillion digital economy, the best future depends on legislation, which should define four new asset classes:

• Digital goods. Bitcoin is such an asset, with no issuer.
• Next are cryptocurrencies, specifically dollar stablecoins issued by regulated banks like Circle;
• Then there are digital securities, which are tokenized stocks that circulate globally 24/7 at the speed of light, like Apple stocks, or tokenized bonds;
• Finally, there are digital tokens, such as tokenized fan clubs, tokenized tickets, and certain types of tokenized memberships.

There are 40 million small businesses in the United States. And if you want to issue a token, to be able to issue it within four hours, you need to have an issuer who needs to explain the role of the token. The token should have some kind of digital or physical use, but it should not provide security, financial use, should not give you liquidation preference over the surviving business, and should not provide a fixed cash flow for 30 years like a bond. It should be the Joe Rogan token or the Katy Perry token. If Katy Perry wanted to issue a token that would give her VIP fans the privilege of booking tickets or concert tours 48 hours in advance, and they bought it, the token would be useful. But it’s not a security. If she doesn’t hold concerts for the rest of her life, this token will collapse. If her concert is exciting, this token will skyrocket.

And TRUMP is the coin of Meme, not a utility coin, how many people will sell this useless token? Only a few people can do it, and if they talk about TRUMP, if Kardashian wants to talk about it, or if Joe Rogan wants to sell something, maybe people will buy it. I happen to think that all four assets have their place, and I think the role of the token is to give access to the capital markets for the 40 million small businesses that have been excluded from the capital markets. But I also think that tokens can create innovative business models. **

If Joe Rogan says I’m going to sell Joe Rogan tokens, you buy tokens and I’ll give you content that only you can access, and if he wants to make money like this, as long as he doesn’t cheat, doesn’t cheat his customers, then he’s fine. If someone opens an eBay account and then sells 47,000 tickets and doesn’t deliver any of them, then it’s clear that the tokens should be subject to consumer protection laws, which is fraud.

Similarly, if you commit fraud on your tokens, you should be prosecuted for consumer fraud and telecom fraud. I believe that the issuer should be held civilly and criminally liable for the damage it causes. But know that it’s no different than driving through the city, and you don’t have to wait four years and spend $40 million on an SEC lawyer to drive through the city. Everyone should have the freedom to do business.

So, at the moment we are in a transition period, there is no market structure bill, and there is no legal definition of digital currency, tokens, securities, digital goods. If we want this industry to grow 100 times or 1000 times, if we want to export, we want the U.S. currency to go global.

If you need digital currencies and want to export securities in the capital market, Apple stocks, ETFs, bonds to the world, you need digital securities. If you wish to realize all the ideas and raise funds for all SMEs, you need crypto tokens. But if you want to export American values, such as sovereignty, trust, currency, freedom, you have to export Bitcoin. Bitcoin is in line with American values, so export this digital commodity.

In my opinion, we clearly need to do a lot of work on Capitol Hill to write it into law, so that these debates and anxieties will disappear. I think the most important thing is that it’s not enough for McKinsey’s lawyers to write just a thousand pages of legal text; the lawyers believe you could be in litigation for twenty years.

You have to define the token so that a billion people can say in five seconds, “Oh, this is the Joe Rogan token, I get it”. You also have to define the currency so that people will say, “This is a digital currency backed by the dollar, I understand,” and if a billion people don’t understand what I just said in five seconds, it won’t work. Once they get it, they say, “It’s a meme coin, anyone can sell it”. It’s just a token, not a security, a commodity, a currency, it’s outside the category.

Q 7: Do you think it is a good idea to add an amendment that prohibits senior officials, including the president, from profiting directly or indirectly from businesses related to stablecoins or tokens? Is it a good idea to introduce such imposed measures?

Saylor: I think an important point to note is that Bitcoin is a commodity, an asset without an issuer. This means that everyone in government, whether you are the president, a senator, or a congressman, can own a piece of gold, can own a house, can raise a chicken, can own farmland, can own timber, soybeans, a barrel of oil, and Bitcoin; Bitcoin is simply a form of property as a commodity.

I believe that the issuer should bear responsibility, and the institutions issuing currency should be subject to oversight from banking regulatory agencies and the FDIC, as they are involved in creating currency. Securities issuers should be regulated by the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission, because if you are going to print $100 billion worth of Apple stock, you must hold Apple stock and bear the corresponding responsibilities.

Token issuers are responsible for any damages caused by their fraudulent actions. If you commit fraud, then you should be liable under consumer protection laws and any other applicable laws. This should apply to everyone.

Q 8: Since January, we’ve seen the SEC, OCC, FDIC, FED all undo policies that hinder the adoption of cryptocurrencies in the U.S., and you’ve been here since Monday and you’ve seen a lot of people like Vice President Vance, David Sacks, what kind of conversations are you having with them about what’s next? **

Saylor: I believe that what really matters in the future is that the government must clearly state that Bitcoin is a legitimate asset, it is digital gold, a type of digital commodity. They need to promote to the world that it is neither a security nor a token, nor a collectible or currency.

It is a digital commodity, Bitcoin reached a market value of 2 trillion dollars without the support of banking systems, insurance companies, credit rating agencies, and mainstream media, and most of the power authorities in the world are skeptical about it. Therefore, for Bitcoin to reach new heights and bring prosperity to us and the world, it needs to promote education to the world.

Then, all of these traditional financial structures of the 20th century saw it as at least a neutral asset. For example, this week the Department of Labor removed guidance to discourage people from allowing employees to include Bitcoin in their retirement plans, right? For a while, we were worried that we would be investigated by the Department of Labor if we offered employees the option to buy Bitcoin.

So I believe that the traditional financial system of the entire 20th century has many discriminatory phenomena, and the government should play a leading role in guiding them into 21st century finance.

In addition to this, in the entire digital asset space, as I said, the government needs to clarify three major matters in the law, digital currencies, digital securities, and digital tokens, which will go a long way in alleviating arguments, anxiety, confrontations, and conflicts. It will also accelerate the investment and development of all these digital assets by a factor of 10 to 100, and the United States will be the world’s digital banker, the world’s digital capital market, the world’s digital innovator, right? This is a good thing for the United States and the American people, and it takes a trailblazer to move the nations of the world forward. Until the U.S. defines tokens, currencies, commodities, and securities, countries around the world will not be able to innovate. And then, every one of our allies will move forward, and you’ll see an extraordinary explosion of digital innovation that will lead the United States and the world into 21st century digital finance.

Q 9: Over the past five years, I have been reporting on this event. We have talked before about the shift from a Bitcoin-centric approach to a number of announcements surrounding stablecoins this week. How do you measure the integration of Bitcoin with other areas of the cryptocurrency ecosystem? Do you think we are moving in the right direction?

Saylor: I believe the crypto industry is somewhat divided, with a divide between the Bitcoin community and the cryptocurrency community. Everything that has happened in the past six months, or even possibly the past twelve months, since November 5 of last year, is an unusually close unity among the entire cryptocurrency industry, cryptocurrency innovators, the stablecoin industry, the Bitcoin sector, traditional financiers on Wall Street, and politicians. They are working together in pursuit of a common vision.

There is now a growing realization that the best thing is a commodity for the world and the industry. Bitcoin and its use cases – long-term store of value, capital, currency, use case of the digital dollar is a medium exchange that works for everyone. Then there’s equities, whose use cases are creating capital markets, innovation, and speed. Its use cases are raising capital and creating compelling new products. Two years ago, I thought there was only Bitcoin in the industry, and I grudgingly tolerated it, but a year and a half ago I hated everything else.

I believe we have entered a more open political environment where people are beginning to engage in calm, cautious, and constructive discussions. For example, I can understand why people in Turkey or Argentina might want to have dollars in their wallets. If you are a staunch supporter of Bitcoin, you don’t have to be angry because they want dollars; perhaps Bitcoin has its uses as well.

Then, if you value the US dollar more, you might think that Bitcoin is like a savings account for those who actually have enough US dollars. And if you are a small micro-enterprise, and there are 400 million such enterprises, they may start to feel that maybe there is a way to issue tokens to raise funds and then use that money to grow my business.

I shouldn’t be ashamed or embarrassed that I need to raise money to grow my business, there’s nothing to be embarrassed about. But two years ago their attitude was that if you’re not a commodity, we’re going to put you in jail or put you out of business. **

So, people in the crypto industry have to go through this kabuki-style performance, this dramatic spectacle, as if to say, “I’m going to be a commodity, or I’m going to be finished.” "However, the truth is, they don’t want to be a commodity, they don’t want to be the next Bitcoin, they want to raise money in an ethical, transparent way to grow their business, but there’s no regulatory path to do so. Now people are starting to realize that maybe there is an ethical way to sell tokens. I don’t have to hate Bitcoin anymore. And Bitcoin supporters are thinking, “Well, now we can live in this ecosystem and be a part of it, maybe I don’t hate stablecoin fans, or I hate crypto token holders, or maybe I hate crypto exchanges, or even the crypto industry as a whole.” But I think they’re all doing better. And, together, we all come out stronger. ”

If the country is to overcome its challenges, and the industry is to overcome its challenges, then we must work together to create hundreds of billions of dollars in value. The key breakthrough here is not technology, but regulation, specifically digital tokens, digital securities, and digital currencies. The industry will grow 100-fold and may even grow to 100 trillion or more.

The market value of Bitcoin will soar to trillions, benefiting countries, benefiting industries, and benefiting the world; this is the path forward for our future.